Series 4 - Episode 16

s4t8brett
Level 1 Dungeoneer
Level 1 Dungeoneer
Posts: 99
Joined: Wed Dec 23, 2015 11:04 am

One thing approaches ...

Post by s4t8brett » Fri Dec 21, 2018 6:50 am

Happy Friday 21st December, everyone!

Drassil
Senior Staff
Senior Staff
Posts: 2268
Joined: Tue Sep 30, 2003 3:01 pm
Contact:

Re: One thing approaches ...

Post by Drassil » Sat Dec 22, 2018 12:36 pm

s4t8brett wrote:
Fri Dec 21, 2018 6:50 am
Happy Friday 21st December, everyone!
I hadn't realised that: a Friday then, a Friday this year.

I can't help but think of you and your team at this time of year, Brett. Somebody has tweeted the TV listings from 21st December 1990. You were up against Take Two (a programme which had Tim Child as a guest the following year), Behind the Headlines (co-presented by Sandi Toksvig) and the Fifteen to One Grand Final (not presented by Sandi Toksvig).

s4t8brett
Level 1 Dungeoneer
Level 1 Dungeoneer
Posts: 99
Joined: Wed Dec 23, 2015 11:04 am

Re: Series 4 - Episode 16

Post by s4t8brett » Tue Dec 25, 2018 5:56 pm

Hi Drassil,

Thank you for sharing the tweet with the TV times for Friday 21st December 1990 - interesting to reminisce and amazing to compare it with the schedules of today.

I hope you're having a good Christmas. I thought it was noteworthy this year with the 21st December falling on a Friday.

With best wishes for the New Year,
Brett

Mashibinbin
Staff
Staff
Posts: 396
Joined: Mon Nov 18, 2002 4:38 pm
Location: Wallasey

Re: Series 4 - Episode 16

Post by Mashibinbin » Wed Dec 26, 2018 1:56 pm

I haven't seen that many of these tv listings for Knightmare since their original publication. I wonder if this is the first one to name the team members in it?

User avatar
Morghanna
Level 1 Dungeoneer
Level 1 Dungeoneer
Posts: 97
Joined: Mon Apr 13, 2020 3:37 pm
Location: Kent

Re: Series 4 - Episode 16

Post by Morghanna » Mon Jun 29, 2020 2:25 pm

What an episode, so many points of interest. This could take some time....
Team 8 encountered Brother Mace and earned a "Joker" card. A wonderful moment when Mace mistakenly handed Giles the 3 of hearts instead of the joker. ;D Actor Michael Cule tried to keep a straight face for the remainder of the scene, but his expression made me think that he was desperately hoping for a shout of, "Cut!", which never arrived. He was half-saved by the fact that Mace was clearly supposed to be well-oiled anyway, so any blunder could be explained by that.
An amusing moment at Doorkis, altho not because of the door-monster. The team had forgotten the command and tried several words before they finally remembered the calling, with much relief. ;D You could clearly hear one of the advisors (Robin?) say, "Write that down!"
Passed with 2/3.
On to ariadne's lair and they collected some gold, then played the Joker, so that Motley arrived to distract ariadne.
Used the gold to pay the ferryman for the crossing, then descended the steps to level 3.

In the clue-room they found the key they needed and summoned Merlin, who gifted them the spell "TINY".
The next challenge was the corridor of blades. 8-o After a few near-misses, they found their timing and Giles emerged alive. I am convinced that one of the blades (#8) just clipped Giles' right shoulder, but this should only have damaged his life-force anyway. (Rather like Leo being clipped by the axe or Julian stepping in the flames.)
Next was the vale-bridge and Mogdred made his last ever appearance. Giles very firmly refused Mogdred, then hurried across the bridge before it collapsed.
Into the block&tackle room and a memorable performance. As the room began to break up, Giles was given some frantic directions before somehow eventually making it out safely. 8-o (Much laughter from Treguard.)
They arrived on the transporter pads but, before they could continue, their quest was cut-off incomplete due to the end of the series. >:( >:( >:(

Unbelievable! Yet again the end-of-series curse struck, but this time it was far, far worse.
In S2 & S3 the final team had been cut-off part-way thru level 2 and it seemed harsh, but to cut-off a team who were on the brink of victory was utterly ludicrous.
Given how much quest-time was wasted in this slow-paced series, particularly with the tortuously slow eye-shield sequences, surely they could have done some editing and created another few minutes screen time for team 8 to complete their quest.
It has been stated that team 8 failed the block&tackle, but were allowed to continue. However, there was little logic in the producers doing this, only to cut-off the quest as incomplete in the next room anyway.
(Did this finally produce a change in the approach to series-endings? No, as yet another team were cut-off whilst doing well in S5, but that's for another post....)

Team 8 were extremely unfortunate. They were a very competent team and were one of the most enthusiastic teams ever. (They reminded me of Scott's team in S3 for their general enthusiasm.)
Given how well they did, "DISMISS" seemed rather harsh. "HOME" would have seemed more generous.

The festive ending to the series might have been really nice, but in these circumstances it fell completely flat.

Great sword-play by Samantha Perkins on the closing credits, altho she nearly got a nasty knock on the head when she fumbled it. 8-o
"I think it's about time you got wise to the ways of real magic. The kind that is borne on the dark side." >:D

s4t8brett
Level 1 Dungeoneer
Level 1 Dungeoneer
Posts: 99
Joined: Wed Dec 23, 2015 11:04 am

Re: Series 4 - Episode 16

Post by s4t8brett » Wed Jul 01, 2020 3:52 pm

Dear Morghanna,

Thank you for your insightful and sympathetic reflections (it was Andrew who said, "write that down", in fact - and probably not for the first time!).

"It has been stated that team 8 failed the block&tackle, but were allowed to continue. However, there was
little logic in the producers doing this, only to cut-off the quest as incomplete in the next room anyway."

The Floor Manager told Giles to take four large steps into the Block and Tackle room; for the first take, he ran in, so he was pretty close to the left-hand exit to begin with. After the floor had given way beneath him, I said, "Er, Giles, could you take a large side step to your right, please?" - there was still some floor on that side of him, you see. ;)

So if there were, indeed, little logic in the production team allowing us to continue, only to cut-off the quest as incomplete in the next room anyway (fir tree and wreath delivery notwithstanding!), perhaps the real reason for the second take was a consensus among the production team that the enthusiastic manner of Giles' entry had made the challenge unfair - so we didn't fail it - as hard as it may be to disentangle that motivation from the series ending.

In any event, they allowed us to complete the Transporter Pad room (which we did successfully) and apparently there were four more scenes to go: I venture to suggest that includes the Transporter Pad room itself, plus the final encounter with Mogdred, the Level three weeping door and then the location of our quest object, the Cup that Heals.

User avatar
JamesA
Fright Knight
Fright Knight
Posts: 1545
Joined: Sun Jul 25, 2004 9:33 am
Location: London

Re: Series 4 - Episode 16

Post by JamesA » Wed Jul 01, 2020 6:39 pm

s4t8brett wrote:
Wed Jul 01, 2020 3:52 pm
So if there were, indeed, little logic in the production team allowing us to continue, only to cut-off the quest as incomplete in the next room anyway (fir tree and wreath delivery notwithstanding!)

Brett - not sure if you saw this post recently, but it's worth having a look at the Twitch video mentioned within as it looks at your quest referencing what you've mentioned above.
James Aukett
Creator of the Knightmare: 25th Anniversary Documentary

s4t8brett
Level 1 Dungeoneer
Level 1 Dungeoneer
Posts: 99
Joined: Wed Dec 23, 2015 11:04 am

Re: Series 4 - Episode 16

Post by s4t8brett » Wed Jul 01, 2020 9:09 pm

Thanks very much, James - I'll take a look.

User avatar
Morghanna
Level 1 Dungeoneer
Level 1 Dungeoneer
Posts: 97
Joined: Mon Apr 13, 2020 3:37 pm
Location: Kent

Re: Series 4 - Episode 16

Post by Morghanna » Thu Jul 02, 2020 11:42 am

Thank-you for your input Brett, it is very much appreciated. It's amazing to actually hear from someone who experienced Knightmare in person. It shows how much armchair fans (like myself) miss. That's good that the producers wanted to make the challenge as fair as possible.
From your deduction of what obstacles remained, you were very close to completion.
"I think it's about time you got wise to the ways of real magic. The kind that is borne on the dark side." >:D

Drassil
Senior Staff
Senior Staff
Posts: 2268
Joined: Tue Sep 30, 2003 3:01 pm
Contact:

Re: Series 4 - Episode 16

Post by Drassil » Sun Jul 05, 2020 10:39 am

It seems an obvious observation, but doesn't appear to have been made before: this episode marked the halfway point in Knightmare's TV run as both the end of Series 4 of 8 and as Episode 56 of 112. In terms of minutes, perhaps the halfway point falls elsewhere as not all episodes were precisely the same duration.

Morghanna wrote:
Mon Jun 29, 2020 2:25 pm
The festive ending to the series might have been really nice, but in these circumstances it fell completely flat.

There've been some entertaining forum comments about the Christmas ending over the years, including:
GrimaldineGrimwold wrote:
Sat Jan 03, 2004 6:39 pm
As I've said so many times, I think the end to Series 4 is sickening, with my main focus for scorn being that dreadful Christmas scene, which I just can't watch.
darkDescender wrote:
Wed Aug 25, 2004 11:11 am
Let me just start by saying this ep had the best ending of any series. No contest. Oh. Sorry. Wait a second...Lie Mode cancel...ahem ... the less said about the chrimbo ending, the better.

We even jointly wrote a fanfic via this forum about Merlin stealing Christmas.

But here's what dungeoneer Giles himself had to say about the Christmas ending when he posted on the forum 15 years ago:
Giles wrote:
Fri Dec 16, 2005 9:27 am
We hated that, it was really childish and made us feel really uncomfortable. It was filmed in mid august too.

Post Reply