TAPE PIRACY

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Re:TAPE PIRACY ON EBAY!

Post by www.playps2.net » Thu Jul 21, 2005 11:06 am

Despite the previous points raised, you’re still adamant that the official DVD release is hindered on bootleg copies from TV? Your interesting point of royalties and fees only cements the fact that no official DVD will ever be a worthwhile venture.

While I can understand that you and many others are upset over other people are making money from the Knightmare brand, who is to say that this is a bad thing?

I do not condone piracy in any form, but that fact that Knightmare has reached cult status is a testament to how strong and popular the show was and still is. The more people that watch the show the longer the buzz is kept alive. Not only this, but is essential for inspiring further generations to watch the show (that would otherwise have missed out).

Business wise, I think Granada would shoot themselves in the foot if an official DVD release ever made it into production. The widespread distribution of the episodes makes the chance to resell broadcast rights extremely unattractive – selling rights/contracts is easier than selling direct to customer.

People like you and me are blessed with having the resources to watch the show. But many don’t have access to Sky, DVDs or archived episodes. To me, grumpled fans reporting these discs are actually quite selfish – you’re denying other fans the chance to relive these shows and limiting its fan base to the hardcore only, ultimately reducing the interest and future developments of the show.
Last edited by www.playps2.net on Thu Jul 21, 2005 11:41 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Re:TAPE PIRACY ON EBAY!

Post by TheBrollachan » Thu Jul 21, 2005 11:40 am

I don't suppose you are 'jegz1uk' on eBay currently flogging DVDs by any chance then? ::)

"grumpled fans reporting these discs are actually quite selfish"
No they are just stopping those who try cashing in on Knightmare's success.

If these sellers are not in it for the money then explain why none of the DVD items on eBay have been 'Buy-it-now' sales? It seems that they would much rather it was an ordinary auction, as that way the selling/bid price can increase and therefore they make more money out of it. Prehaps if the items were 'Buy-it-now' only at a reasonable, very near cost price then there would be less of an urge to report the sale. After all video trading of Knightmare epsiodes went on fairly openly for some time until some decided to try and cash in on the trading.

Incidentally the currently eBay DVD seller knows it is illegal as they got the 'ask seller a question' which informed them of an inaccuracy and the fact it is illegal. They've corrected the inaccuracy but left the auction running.
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Re:TAPE PIRACY ON EBAY!

Post by Kieran » Thu Jul 21, 2005 1:50 pm

'To me, grumpled fans reporting these discs are actually quite selfish – you’re denying other fans the chance to relive these shows and limiting its fan base to the hardcore only, ultimately reducing the interest and future developments of the show. '

Regardless of what the 'hardcore fans' may or may not think, I think we do have to keep in mind what the shows producer has said on this matter. As he believes these pirate DVDs should be stopped, we as a community can only support him in that. I think it would be unfortunate for people to make profit on the back of someone elses work.

I think his wishes ought to be respected.
Last edited by Kieran on Thu Jul 21, 2005 1:53 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re:TAPE PIRACY ON EBAY!

Post by www.playps2.net » Thu Jul 21, 2005 2:11 pm

Trust me, if I did something on eBay, you would know about it!

I’m not going to speculate on the rational behind putting it up for auction. Perhaps the seller prefers it that way – lower insertion fees etc. I don’t care. But people don’t do things for free – there has to be an incentive.

You have episodes right (albeit illegal in itself); would you distribute these to fans for free or at cost? I think not. For the buyer, it must feel like finding gold.

You know yourself that an official DVD would never happen (as explained previously) simply because of cost. Not only would there be costs in production, but marketing them and then finding the distribution channels to get them to the consumer. It all feels unworthwhile.

Keeping things alive isn’t down a few people. You need to build a bigger community and to find new blood. It’s a narrow minded view that unofficial = bad.

Before I discovered this forum, I was actually planning on doing some sets, but given the turbulent circumstances I think not.

Knightmare Year One: Limited Edition
1 disc – Dual Layer media 8.5GB worth of video
Treguard Manga artwork cover in high gloss!
DVD quality video, 2ch AC3 audio.
Animated menus, episode selection
PSP video files to watch on the go.

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Re:TAPE PIRACY ON EBAY!

Post by TheBrollachan » Thu Jul 21, 2005 2:36 pm

www.playps2.net wrote: Before I discovered this forum, I was actually planning on doing some sets, but given the turbulent circumstances I think not.

Knightmare Year One: Limited Edition
1 disc – Dual Layer media 8.5GB worth of video
Treguard Manga artwork cover in high gloss!
DVD quality video, 2ch AC3 audio.
Animated menus, episode selection
PSP video files to watch on the go.
Well I'm glad we've put you off doing something that is illegal.
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Re:TAPE PIRACY ON EBAY!

Post by www.playps2.net » Thu Jul 21, 2005 2:37 pm

Will you delete your tapes and throw away your DVDs now?

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Re:TAPE PIRACY ON EBAY!

Post by TheBrollachan » Thu Jul 21, 2005 2:43 pm

www.playps2.net wrote: Will you delete your tapes and throw away your DVDs now?
Will you stop trolling this forum?


(Edit: As far as I can see there is no difference in eBay fees for Buy it now v Auction.
http://pages.ebay.co.uk/help/sell/fees.html )
Last edited by TheBrollachan on Thu Jul 21, 2005 2:55 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re:TAPE PIRACY ON EBAY!

Post by www.playps2.net » Thu Jul 21, 2005 3:04 pm

I don’t want to speculate on his rational. Like I said I don’t care – I just hope that the winning buyer enjoys his episodes, will discover this site, and start posting on this forum and talk about how great it is. Then pass them on to other people which in turn will create more fans. Which then, stimulate interest in further developments and ideas for new series’

I have an opinion, and want to voice it. I’m new member and already you’ve shown how hostile it can be if I don’t share the same thoughts.

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Re:TAPE PIRACY ON EBAY!

Post by Skarkill » Thu Jul 21, 2005 8:40 pm

I'm gonner throw my 10 cents worth in here.

Now I know full well that me condeming Piracy is going to be some what Hypocritical since I copy themes of the net to trade with people (all be it not for profit).

BUT

I have to agree with Broll the fact that Pirate DVD's or VHS are circulating out there.

Deminish the chances no matter how slender that an offical DVD will ever be relaesed.
Which then, stimulate interest in further developments and ideas for new series’
Sadly with the droping of the KM VR Idea this is at this junction in time even more unlikely then a DVD realesed.



And as Kirean has stated the creator of KM has said that Priating of KM tapes ect should be stopped.

And I have to agree it is his work (as well as others) and his creation, and it is n't right for otheres to make money off of his and his Cast & crew's hard work.
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Re:TAPE PIRACY ON EBAY!

Post by www.playps2.net » Sat Jul 23, 2005 2:15 pm

Despite my comments, I cannot believe that they have been ignored, and how bullish everyone remains.

Whereas Knightmare was pioneering back in the 80s, perhaps the concept and format simply doesn’t work as a game show anymore. The low interest in Knightmare VR proves this – there simply isn’t enough of a market to justify the investment.

What developers and producers should be considering is the technology available, and what this represents in terms of opportunities to take Knightmare further.

VR simply didn’t work. And developers take note: with the current generation of games consoles, the technology is there for you. Puzzle solving based game, with real time rendered graphics. Unlockable cel-shaded graphics, online play.

All this is there for you.

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Re:TAPE PIRACY ON EBAY!

Post by MoanaLiza » Wed Jul 27, 2005 3:50 pm

Okay enough said. We all (well most of us) know what the rules are in terms of tape/dvd trading. I would put my opinions in but it's just adding to the fueling, but I will say that I agree 100% with Kieran in terms of respecting the creator's wishes. Please can this thread be locked before it turns into a full flame war, thanks! (maybe I'm getting a little hot headed)
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Re:TAPE PIRACY ON EBAY!

Post by Drassil » Fri Jul 29, 2005 1:48 pm

The Brollachan wrote:
www.playps2.net wrote: Will you delete your tapes and throw away your DVDs now?
Will you stop trolling this forum?
Surely it's for the Moderators to decide whether a user is trolling? Piracy will always be a controversial topic among Knightmare fans, but turning this from a Discussion Forum into a Name-Calling Forum seems unconstructive to me.

That aside, I'm glad that such an important issue has been examined so thoroughly, and I respect the fact that those who've contributed have opinions both different and strong. That alone would be no reason for censorship, so please don't lock this thread.
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Re:TAPE PIRACY ON EBAY!

Post by Kieran » Fri Jul 29, 2005 1:57 pm

Thank you for the level headed comments above ~ I myself do not think it is necessary to 'lock' the thread, most of the views within it have been well portrayed, however I must agree that resorting to making these issues personal does nothing to help the situation at all.

I must also remind people that if there is (perceived to be) a problem on the forum, the best way to deal with it is by reporting the topic or the post, and then it can be dealt with in a way that keeps arguments off the forum. I am quite sure most people know this is the procedure, so it would be helpful if everyone would use this manner in the future.

Happy debating. :)
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Re:TAPE PIRACY ON EBAY!

Post by Fidjit » Fri Jul 29, 2005 2:15 pm

Le's just hope all these frauders are put to justice soon!
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Re:TAPE PIRACY ON EBAY!

Post by TheBrollachan » Fri Jul 29, 2005 2:38 pm

What amazed me was that one Knightmare DVD auction this week had the nerve to take the season 6 stats box from Knightmare.com, and paste it layout and all into their auction description. In fairness the auction was actually removed by the seller.

As there have been attempts to compare recording TV programmes onto VHS for personal use and selling DVD copies I thought I would raise a new point.

Both are illegal, albeit watching personal recordings more than once isn't taken that seriously. However the first means you have persumably paid for subscription to Sky/NTL etc. and have then decided to record the show onto VHS or DVD (or computer). Whereas the second means that you have done the first AND then sold on copies, ie. reproduced something you don't own the copyright to.

It often the case that people who do this are doing this for their own personal financial gain, though this is besides the point.
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