Re:Forum Concern...

Kieran · Post by **Kieran** » 17 Jun 2004, 23:18

I'd agree that a rule would be....Only if there is a clear complaint/cry for help should a moderator intervene as such. At least then it keeps a cap on how much the Mod could do.

Action to a complaint should be dealt with via PM's, between two people if necessary, and if a particular post is particularly bad, say it has accusations and swearing in it, etc, then the post should be removed.

However, upon removal, there should be a fully justifyable account as to why the action was taken in the first place, and if the person in questions disagrees with the Mods decision, it should then be handed over to the top Mod, Nic obviously, and the situation will be dealt with with both sides of the story weighed up.

How does that sound?

Malefact · Post by **Malefact** » 17 Jun 2004, 23:26

Indeed. I think it's important for there to be strict guidelines for dealing with any issues that might arise. If that weren't the case, there would be inconsistency. It might be inescapable, though. If a post is reported, then there will still be a degree of judgement involved on the part of the moderator. Is the post belligerent or not? This decision would have to be made.

Different kinds of situations will come up, though. Dealing with it, despite having a comprehesive procedure, will still involve discretion on the part of the mod. The mod must therefore be able to judge as well as possible.

Regarding action, I guess PM-ing is the best approach because it minimises negativity on the forum. Deleting posts might not be immediately possible - indeed, it might be avoidable if mere misunderstanding is involved in the part of the people involved. It would be necessary, in that case however, to post in the thread in question that the situation has been resolved.

There will be the occasional person, though, who cannot be reasoned with. They will either be convinced that they are doing nothing wrong or are deliberately having fun at the expense of others, knowing full well. I'm sure the mod would have no trouble in recommending the latter person be banned. The situation of the former person, though, is tricker. Again, it's a matter of discretion.

This is muddy territory, imo. It's just a ruddy shame that this kind of thing is necessary.

P.S.: Nice to see you posting, Forester! Shame about the circumstances.

Kieran · Post by **Kieran** » 17 Jun 2004, 23:32

Malefact wrote: Indeed. I think it's important for there to be strict guidelines for dealing with any issues that might arise. If that weren't the case, there would be inconsistency. It might be inescapable, though. If a post is reported, then there will still be a degree of judgement involved on the part of the moderator. Is the post belligerent or not? This decision would have to be made.

Different kinds of situations will come up, though. Dealing with it, despite having a comprehesive procedure, will still involve discretion on the part of the mod. The mod must therefore be able to judge as well as possible.

Regarding action, I guess PM-ing is the best approach because it minimises negativity on the forum. Deleting posts might not be immediately possible - indeed, it might be avoidable if mere misunderstanding is involved in the part of the people involved. It would be necessary, in that case however, to post in the thread in question that the situation has been resolved.

There will be the occasional person, though, who cannot be reasoned with. They will either be convinced that they are doing nothing wrong or are deliberately having fun at the expense of others, knowing full well. I'm sure the mod would have no trouble in recommending the latter person be banned. The situation of the former person, though, is tricker. Again, it's a matter of discretion.

This is muddy territory, imo. It's just a ruddy shame that this kind of thing is necessary.

P.S.: Nice to see you posting, Forester! Shame about the circumstances.

Yes tend to agree on those points, my post, about deleting posts only covers a post which is majorly/deliberately offenssive. I think the subtle PM approach is the best idea.

No major action such as deleting a post should be taken unless what you do is fully justifyable. If you can explain why something was done, then the decision will have been assessed to the highest degree it possible could have been, as there is no set 'right' or 'wrong' way until any situation is properly thought through.

Post by **KaM** » 18 Jun 2004, 01:46

Hello all (not that anyone would know, remember or, indeed, care about this voice) - on the eve of my losing connection for a month, I thought I'd break a recent habit and quickly check the forum for any sign of 'breakthrough'. I'm saddened: I used to be enthused to frequent the forums, used to take pride in providing long and detailed thoughts; feel pride in being one of a special crowd of Knightmare fans. I joined the forum under the guise that I would 'not find a friendlier online community' (-- --- ---; dulce et decorum est...) ~ and yet I only keep my account open under the dream that something will change.

This community is fast turning into a cult, and I'm not wanting part of it. I feel a little belittled by the thought and effort I used to put into every word I posted upon this forum, and it now feels rather meaningless. More to the point, I used to feel that regular posting in this forum was a engaging and complementative part of being a Knightmare fan, and now (although admittedly, I think I've been forever put off by an argument in January), where I used to think it a necessity to prove oneself as a dedicated fan, I couldn't care less. I would never single anyone out - perhaps it was meant to happen this way; but although I can't speak any further for Robin and Forester other than that I seem to currently share a trend, I'm gutted that I'm put off doing what I so loved last year.

Said my piece and made my peace.
KaM

Kieran · Post by **Kieran** » 18 Jun 2004, 01:55

I am terribly sorry to read that Keith, I can only hope that todays suggestions will have helped you a little and that you won't abandon the place entirely.

Hope to see you around soon.

Post by **Mashibinbin** » 18 Jun 2004, 03:55

I suggest something along the lines of NKTPS moderators board. For each major board such as this one 'Website feedback' a moderator should be assigned to keep an eye and then report back to other mods so that votes and fair discussion can take place over warnings and/or deletion of posts which might be biased or contentious if if based solely on judgement of one person. There are 7 such boards so a majority of 4 say would justify appropiate action being taken I nominate Kieran, Malefact, Emii, Redmage, Ringmasterrob, GG, and Pooka (ben maydon cos I think there a few of you sprites lurking around).

Lord_Bob · Post by **Lord_Bob** » 18 Jun 2004, 08:05

I would chip in a big long piece here but I don't think its needed, the silence of some of the oldest and longest posters around here and the fact that they want to leave the forum says more than I really could. Even I have become a lurker nowadays, when I used to post so often. Appointing mods would be a good solution in my mind. I would like to nominate; Kieran & Malefact. That's what I have to say on the subject

rachelesque · Post by **rachelesque** » 18 Jun 2004, 09:17

Okay, figured I would raise my head for the drama. I can think of a lot of people I wouldn't want to be mods because I think they would let it go to their heads and start stomping around going 'I'm a mod which makes me better' and they really don't need to be any more arrogant or have more ammunition to make them consider themselves elitist.

I think the fairest way to organise this would be anyone interested (so we don't get people badgered into the post) writes a basic summary of why they would be a fair choice then we have a democratic vote. If we make it registered users before a certain date only that should stop people making extra accounts etc (although why anyone would do that is beyond me).

I like Forester's suggestion that they can only affect posts reported by other members, but they could just report them themselves. Maybe they could only do something where there is definitely a problem and leave Illusion to the more contraversial decisions?

TheBrollachan · Post by **TheBrollachan** » 18 Jun 2004, 10:41

Moderator powers depend on what the board is capable of. The problem can be knowing when to moderate, as if you edited/deleted/locked everything you didn't like then nobody would use the board. I would recommend that moderators only intervine when the 'Report to moderator' feature has been used, or if its obvious the something needs acting on quickly.

In regards to who should be moderators I think that rachelesque's suggestion would be a good idea. Prehaps put the moderators on trial for a month so to speak.

Not every forum needs to necessarily have extra moderators in. From looking at things the main forum that needs an extra moderator is the General Discussion, as the rest of the forums don't seem to get as many problems.

Fidjit · Post by **Fidjit** » 18 Jun 2004, 13:57

Who are the moderators?

TheBrollachan · Post by **TheBrollachan** » 18 Jun 2004, 14:10

At the moment I think it's just Illusion and mysteria for the Bring Back forum.

Lord_Bob · Post by **Lord_Bob** » 18 Jun 2004, 18:46

I personally think Illusion should ask candidates, via a private PM or email if they want to be mods and wait for replies. Otherwise anyone can nominate themselves and if a vote happened everyone could see the results and those not voted for might be hurt or feel a little unwanted. Plus, and i'm not suggesting people WOULD do this but it's possible, people could conspire to mass vote for one candidate causing unfairness. My own opinion is should Illusion want mods then he should be able to choose them at his own leisure, and should those people not want the position they have the chance to refuse.

MoanaLiza · Post by **MoanaLiza** » 18 Jun 2004, 18:58

True, I see your point. Would it perhaps be an idea for some, i.e. long term members PM Illusion with suggestions who they think should be mods instead also then? I mean Illusion could still make a decision of who he thinks whether they were suggested or not.

HarveyTowers · Post by **HarveyTowers** » 18 Jun 2004, 20:01

Consistency is needed. Members do try to keep order themselves but it usually leads to more disputes despite the best intentions. Perhaps members, especially our stalwarts, should be encouraged to use the "report to moderator" button more often. Don't know if its possible, but maybe if a number of complaints are recieved about any one thread - it could be automatically removed until Illusion can investigate it further. If new moderators are to be appointed - maybe try them out on the off-topic forum or only in one area e.g. Knewies welcome.

In general, I would just like to appeal to members to consider carefully what they are writing - it is not enjoyable to log in and read arguments between members. Please show courtesy and respect at all times.

Illusion · Post by **Illusion** » 18 Jun 2004, 21:21

Thanks for all your comments. In reply to a few points:

I would only appoint moderators for the General Discussion board, and no more than two at a time (excluding myself). The other sections of the forum I feel do not need any additional moderation.

I agree that moderators should only act upon a reported post. In the first instance, the reported member should be sent an IM explaing the problem. This IM is copied to all other moderators for reference.

The exception to this is for a blatently abusive message which clearly would need to be removed/editied straight away. A moderator would then send a warning.

As at present, I will personally remove accounts of users who continue to misuse the forum (after being warned at least once). Thankfully this is a rare occurance.

I agree that a consistant approach is necessary, but at the same time we would go mad if we had to write out moderator guidelines covering every single eventuality. I would initially invite moderators based on who I think would be good at it, based on their contribution to the forum (post history), interaction with members, understanding of the issues and are also regular users.